Five years ago, Hugh White lobbed a grenade into Australia's debate about the world with his Quarterly Essay 'Power Shift'. His subsequent book 'The China Choic'e and the often strong reactions to it have helped set the terms for how Australians 'and increasingly many around the world' think and talk about the big strategic changes in Asia. In this special In Conversation event, Professor White talks to Fairfax's former China correspondent, John Garnaut. The recording looks back at the five years since Power Shift was released, and explores how the debate in Australia and globally has changed and evolved in its wake. The conversation looks at what White got right, what he got wrong, and how he sees the region changing today.